Comments on: Is the emulation singularity near? http://rdist.root.org/2008/04/03/is-the-emulation-singularity-near/ Embedded security, crypto, software protection Mon, 08 Mar 2010 21:19:29 +0000 http://wordpress.com/ hourly 1 By: Stephan Sokolow http://rdist.root.org/2008/04/03/is-the-emulation-singularity-near/#comment-4595 Stephan Sokolow Sun, 04 May 2008 16:11:11 +0000 http://rdist.wordpress.com/?p=126#comment-4595 Mike, Copyrighted BIOSes slow things, but they don't stop them. As I understand it, there's a reverse-engineered BIOS for the PSX called FakeBIOS which already has fairly good compatibility when used in emulators. Mike,

Copyrighted BIOSes slow things, but they don’t stop them. As I understand it, there’s a reverse-engineered BIOS for the PSX called FakeBIOS which already has fairly good compatibility when used in emulators.

]]> By: Nate Lawson http://rdist.root.org/2008/04/03/is-the-emulation-singularity-near/#comment-4575 Nate Lawson Mon, 21 Apr 2008 05:51:59 +0000 http://rdist.wordpress.com/?p=126#comment-4575 Simics looks nice, especially if you want to simulate some non-standard board design and its peripherals. It also would be good if you're prototyping a new CPU. That's a sweet spot not covered by other emulators. However, according to the Usenix paper, they ran at about 2% of native speed. I assume they've done work to improve this a lot since 1998, but it sounds like this is only part of the emulation solution. You'd still need VMware or something for speed on the x86 operating systems. Simics looks nice, especially if you want to simulate some non-standard board design and its peripherals. It also would be good if you’re prototyping a new CPU. That’s a sweet spot not covered by other emulators.

However, according to the Usenix paper, they ran at about 2% of native speed. I assume they’ve done work to improve this a lot since 1998, but it sounds like this is only part of the emulation solution. You’d still need VMware or something for speed on the x86 operating systems.

]]> By: Iker De Echaniz http://rdist.root.org/2008/04/03/is-the-emulation-singularity-near/#comment-4574 Iker De Echaniz Sun, 20 Apr 2008 11:53:27 +0000 http://rdist.wordpress.com/?p=126#comment-4574 Have you seen simics from virtutech? Have you seen simics from virtutech?

]]> By: Nate Lawson http://rdist.root.org/2008/04/03/is-the-emulation-singularity-near/#comment-4560 Nate Lawson Sun, 13 Apr 2008 02:43:23 +0000 http://rdist.wordpress.com/?p=126#comment-4560 Ryan, I agree full emulation is one of the hardest attacks to counter when responding to attacks against a DRM system. There are a number of things that keep it from being a game-over scenario: - No emulation is perfect. Especially if you are analyzing the emulator and specifically targeting it, it's nearly impossible to perfectly emulate all aspects of the original with no bugs. This is another reason we came out against the idea of perfect hypervisor rootkits (ones that perfectly emulate an entire x86 PC) - Hardware with a carefully chosen design can be difficult to clone/emulate in software. This is one aspect that protects today's satellite TV smart cards against emulation. Ryan, I agree full emulation is one of the hardest attacks to counter when responding to attacks against a DRM system. There are a number of things that keep it from being a game-over scenario:

- No emulation is perfect. Especially if you are analyzing the emulator and specifically targeting it, it’s nearly impossible to perfectly emulate all aspects of the original with no bugs. This is another reason we came out against the idea of perfect hypervisor rootkits (ones that perfectly emulate an entire x86 PC)

- Hardware with a carefully chosen design can be difficult to clone/emulate in software. This is one aspect that protects today’s satellite TV smart cards against emulation.

]]> By: Ryan Russell http://rdist.root.org/2008/04/03/is-the-emulation-singularity-near/#comment-4555 Ryan Russell Sat, 12 Apr 2008 08:06:43 +0000 http://rdist.wordpress.com/?p=126#comment-4555 Well, emulation is one way to always doom DRM, right? Screw it.. brute force run the whole machine, DRM and all, and rip out each frame and sound bit one at a time, right? Well, emulation is one way to always doom DRM, right? Screw it.. brute force run the whole machine, DRM and all, and rip out each frame and sound bit one at a time, right?

]]> By: Nate Lawson http://rdist.root.org/2008/04/03/is-the-emulation-singularity-near/#comment-4541 Nate Lawson Fri, 04 Apr 2008 04:56:14 +0000 http://rdist.wordpress.com/?p=126#comment-4541 Mike, DRM is doomed! That's the new meme to replace the old one that it is unbreakable and <i>we're</i> doomed. :-) I take a more sanguine view that all instances of protection will eventually be broken. It will only take longer if you have a good design. So I have no worries about the future of emulation or DRM. Mike, DRM is doomed! That’s the new meme to replace the old one that it is unbreakable and we’re doomed. :-)

I take a more sanguine view that all instances of protection will eventually be broken. It will only take longer if you have a good design. So I have no worries about the future of emulation or DRM.

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